Mac Mini

[Atari 5200 Guy]

Hey Guys,

Once I started college in 2009 I always wanted to acquire a Mac Mini.  Don't get too excited as I haven't got one yet.  But I know some here are more familiar with them than I and this is more of a "what would" sort of post and a way to show what I've found so far.

Of course, eBay is about the only place to find a second hand one.  Let's face it...those machines are expensive and I'd never be able to afford a new one at the moment.  I loved We Luv Macs' website but it's apparently went out of business.  So it's most likely eBay.  But I did find an older one fairly priced...I think:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/264530155461

The only problem...it's very bare.  No power supply or OS.  It's also a Power PC processor and I know later models like this one had Intel Core 2 Duo processors in them.  I have plenty of PC keyboards and I have a wireless Logitech mouse I can use on it.  $29.00 + shipping.  My only question is would I be able to use this for any Atari game development?  I'm a dummy when it comes to more modern Macs.  The only Mac I had was an all-in-one eMac (or iMac, can't remember which) that was transparent blue and ran OS 9...barely.  But it was cool to play around with.  I don't own any Apple OSes either so I'd have to find an OS disc I'm sure.

Am I correct in assuming I would need an adapter to use a Mac Mini with one of the VGA monitors I have lying around?  I'd really like to step away from Windows over time.  I don't really care for the operating system.  I never have.  And the PC side of hardware has always had reliability issues.  I'd like a computer that will last and I know Apple computers before Steve Jobs passed were built to last and be easy to use.  Any pointers?  I'm all ears.

If you guys think this would be a good buy let me know and I'll ask my wife if we can get it for me as a Christmas present.

[Atari 5200 Guy]

This one's all setup...but it's the Mac Mini only.  Nothing else is included.  Other items in picture are to show that it works.  1.50 shipping.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Apple-Mac-Mini-1-83-Ghz-Intel-Core-2-Duo-1-GB-80-GB-HD-OS-X-10-7-5/174111645226?hash=item2889dcde2a:g:bqsAAOSwzytdi8o1

[Atari 5200 Guy]

Found OS X on disc:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Macintosh-Operating-System-Install-CD-Mac-OS-X-version-10-2/174108036950?hash=item2889a5cf56:g:TYYAAOSwEbBd3ca5

[Video 61]

On 11/30/2019 at 12:27 PM, kamakazi20012 said:

This one's all setup...but it's the Mac Mini only.  Nothing else is included.  Other items in picture are to show that it works.  1.50 shipping.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Apple-Mac-Mini-1-83-Ghz-Intel-Core-2-Duo-1-GB-80-GB-HD-OS-X-10-7-5/174111645226?hash=item2889dcde2a:g:bqsAAOSwzytdi8o1

hi michael,

 

 i use mine every day, its the dual core one, i have one as a backup, steve has one also. i will check with my son to see if he has one available.

 

lance

www.atarisales.com

 

[Atari 5200 Guy]

Ubuntu is nice but it requires a computer with far more specs than anything I currently have here.  I'd really like to step away from Windows. 

Windows 7 is coming to an end soon and I don't like Windows 10 at all.  I've played around with the display models at Wal-Mart and, yuck, Windows 10 is not for me.  Microsoft has been sending me message after message saying support for Windows 7 will end in January 2020.  So if I can find a Mac Mini with OS X of some kind I'd like to make the switch.  I can still use a Windows computer for Atari development until I find everything I need to do the same on a Mac.  And I know you guys would know what I'd need to do stuff like that and I know some of the same software I use on Window 7 for that is also available for Macs.  I use free software with the exception of my Adobe software.  That's Windows only unfortunately.  And I would not want to use Boot Camp...I have Windows machines I can use if I absolutely have no other choice.  I would need the adapter to connect a VGA monitor to it, though.  That I do not have.

It just seems like Windows systems are getting very unreliable.  The laptop you sent me has been trucking on very well but I've upgraded some parts on it as well to help improve performance.  But every other Windows system I have has ran into issues, even ones I rarely use.  The Dell I have setup strictly for ST purposes likes to turn itself on from a full power down.  I haven't figured that one out so I just keep it unplugged when I'm not using it.  The power button is not stuck so it's not that.  As soon as I plug that system in and wait 5 seconds it turns on.

The dual-core Mini's are those with the all aluminum body, right?      

[Video 61]

1 hour ago, kamakazi20012 said:

Ubuntu is nice but it requires a computer with far more specs than anything I currently have here.  I'd really like to step away from Windows. 

Windows 7 is coming to an end soon and I don't like Windows 10 at all.  I've played around with the display models at Wal-Mart and, yuck, Windows 10 is not for me.  Microsoft has been sending me message after message saying support for Windows 7 will end in January 2020.  So if I can find a Mac Mini with OS X of some kind I'd like to make the switch.  I can still use a Windows computer for Atari development until I find everything I need to do the same on a Mac.  And I know you guys would know what I'd need to do stuff like that and I know some of the same software I use on Window 7 for that is also available for Macs.  I use free software with the exception of my Adobe software.  That's Windows only unfortunately.  And I would not want to use Boot Camp...I have Windows machines I can use if I absolutely have no other choice.  I would need the adapter to connect a VGA monitor to it, though.  That I do not have.

It just seems like Windows systems are getting very unreliable.  The laptop you sent me has been trucking on very well but I've upgraded some parts on it as well to help improve performance.  But every other Windows system I have has ran into issues, even ones I rarely use.  The Dell I have setup strictly for ST purposes likes to turn itself on from a full power down.  I haven't figured that one out so I just keep it unplugged when I'm not using it.  The power button is not stuck so it's not that.  As soon as I plug that system in and wait 5 seconds it turns on.

The dual-core Mini's are those with the all aluminum body, right?      

hi michael,

 

 yes, aluminum. i will ask my son if he has anything and stock, and what is the o.s. they are using.

i do not use pc'es at all, junk. can't use the laptop i sent for you to use?

lance

www.atarisales.com

[Atari 5200 Guy]

A lot of it is with me, Lance.  I'm just tired of Windows and the whole IBM PC way of things.  At times it seems like it doesn't matter how much you upgrade hardware Windows will say it's not enough.  The laptop I can use for things I can't do on a Mac (like my Adobe software) but I thought for $30 I can start on getting myself an Apple computer.  I've liked Macs better since the Mac Mini you use was released.  I enjoyed my first gen iPad a LOT and I did a lot with it.  I never had any issues with it and that's why I'm after a Mac Mini.  I would like a computer where it just works, no issues.  Apple computers do that...IBM PCs do not and never have.

But, the laptop you sent is starting to do the exact same thing my gaming laptop did.  The power supply is starting to split on the end that plugs into the computer.  I can see the insulated wires inside (a red and black one).  And I know a lot of it is because I move it from my lap when I use it to where it goes when I'm done with it.  I would like to try Ubuntu again but the latest version requires hardware I don't have.  And trying to install an older version will automatically update to the latest version.  I know...I tried already.  I'd easily give up my Windows desktops (except the one I have setup for ST stuff) for a Mac Mini.

Don't get me wrong...I'm very grateful for the laptop you sent to use.  I wouldn't be able to do what I am doing without it.  I'm more of an Apple person but stuck in an IBM world. 

[DegasElite]

I have a Core Solo Mac mini. It can be upgraded to a Core2Duo, with extra RAM, but I never use it much anymore. I have it in my bedroom in a dresser drawer for now.

I agree with you, Mike. I am a Mac-head myself. I am hoping that they make ARM-based Macs with RISC instructions. I think that then they might be faster with computations. I think that they are starting to head into that direction, but I do not know if that is the case. Apple has been pretty iffy nowadays with their product lines. I do know that the new Mac Pro is being assembled in Austin, TX. Apple just started doing that. Thanks for letting me share.

[Video 61]

1 hour ago, BlackCatz40 said:

I have a Core Solo Mac mini. It can be upgraded to a Core2Duo, with extra RAM, but I never use it much anymore. I have it in my bedroom in a dresser drawer for now.

I agree with you, Mike. I am a Mac-head myself. I am hoping that they make ARM-based Macs with RISC instructions. I think that then they might be faster with computations. I think that they are starting to head into that direction, but I do not know if that is the case. Apple has been pretty iffy nowadays with their product lines. I do know that the new Mac Pro is being assembled in Austin, TX. Apple just started doing that. Thanks for letting me share.

hi steve,

 

 do you ever plan on using the mac mini? i completely understand where michael is coming from.

 

lance

www.atarisales.com

 

[Atari 5200 Guy]

I'm sorry guys.  If it sounds like I'm being ungrateful about the things that have been sent for me to use because I'm not.  If all I had to worry about with a computer was a simple memory upgrade, which I know when you upgrade a Mac's RAM it's the happiest computer in the world, then it would bring back the pleasures of using a computer.  Windows lost that a long time ago.  Honestly, I don't think Windows ever had that.  Why do people use the computers they have?  For me it's because I enjoy using them.  If I don't enjoy using them then I simply won't use it.  Windows has reached that point with me.  It's always a struggle, mentally, trying to get Windows to cooperate with even simple tasks.  It's a pain the ass when it does it's blue screen of death while you are working on something important.

That iMac I found shortly after my first wife and I split surprised me.  I spent $30 of my last $40 on me and took a chance on it.  I had to take it to a friend's house whom I worked with at Wal-Mart.  I knew he had a few of them because he used them as work computers as he worked from home, and helped me set it up with a new OS (OS X, just don't remember which OS X), bumped up the RAM, and the thing came to life right before my eyes.  I couldn't believe how simple installing the OS was.  No questions asked.  And the damn thing booted up quick for an old machine.  I was like, "Why can't Windows do such things?"  What surprised me even more was I had a Sony PSP at the time and I needed to charge it so I took advantage and connected it to the iMac I just bought to charge it up.  This old iMac recognized the PSP right away without having to download anything.  While it was charging I was able to browse the PSP's storage to see what all I had on there.  It knew what my PSP was!

I had fun with that little computer thanks to my friend putting some games on it for me to play.  I really liked the Mac suite of, for lack of better wording, office software.  The word processor was awesome and simple to use unlike Microsoft's WordPerfect.  It was a nightmare.  

Like I said before, I can use Windows for things I simply can't do on a Mac.  But I'm to the point I'm done with Windows.  The only thing Microsoft I want to continue to enjoy is XBOX.  That's it.  I'm tired of having to upgrade a machine just to run a piece of software that doesn't work even with upgrades that exceed what the software required.  It's BS, a scam, and I've enough of it.  

Games I play on Windows I can get for a Mac through Steam so I'm not to worried.  Macs are built like a tank.  At least the iMac I owned was and from the keynotes I remember seeing with Steve Jobs showing off the all-aluminum Mac Mini, it looked like it was built like a tank, too.  I just want something that works the second I turn it on, I can do what need to get done, no hassles, no issues, no problems, so I can be more productive.

If you are wondering where all this came from...I was working on something.  Had it half done.  Windows crashed before I could save. I had them open, touching them up as I worked on others, an hour's worth of work.  Gone.  Blue screen of death.  To say it pissed me off would be putting it lightly.  I wanted to destroy every Windows CD I had, wipe out every hard drive I have with Windows on it for use on something different.  I've not once heard of anyone having issues like that on an Apple computer...never.  And from the iPad apps I used before I know that Apple stuff simply works better.  It's tailored for the machines and it works.  I loved the keynotes app I had on my iPad.  It took a LOT of extra work I would have had to do on a Windows machine away.  

I'll admit that today's Apple, since Steve's passing, GOD rest his soul, has been iffy at best.  But when Steve was back at the helm of Apple things were impressive.  I miss seeing his keynote presentations.  "Just One More Thing", and I was on the edge of my seat, as close to the screen as I could get.  Then the Mac Mini appeared and my jaw dropped.  I wanted it.  He didn't have to say any more but he did.  "The affordable entry-level Mac for those that want to make the switch."  And that was it.  I was sold.  I loved what my eyes were seeing.  I never looked at PCs the same again.  Mac was the best money could buy...and I was stuck with POS Windows and the crappy hardware it works with?  Why?  

Yea, with a PC you can add this, pop that in there, double up on the graphics cards (seriously?  who needs that much damn graphics power?), max out all the drive bays with more space than any one will ever need in a lifetime.  What you end up with is a PC that becomes a fire hazard or at least heat your house up pretty good that costs 2 time to 3 times more than the most expensive Mac on the market.  And if you are lucky, it might work half the time if it doesn't shut off from over heating or over loads.  I just want something that works, period, no questions asked, no hassles, no issues, just hit the button to turn it on and do what you need to get done.  If I could I would throw every damn Windows PC I have here in the damn dumpster.  That's where they belong.  I'm done with Windows.  I'll use it only if I absolutely have to.  I'd keep the monitors I have, though, because those work with anything.  I can even use those with an adapter to play HDMI able video game consoles on. 

As for me and Windows...it's time I parted ways with it.  I'm tired of constantly losing hard work because Windows decides it wants to be a d*ck for no reason.  So, nope, I'm done with it.  Here...have a bird of paradise Windows.  If I could use an Atari 8-bit or ST computer to get online and check my emails, visit Atari I/O, and do my YouTube stuff I'd just use those...but I can't. Ubuntu is a small blessing in disguise but, again, it's on Windows hardware and if I'm having issues with Windows then who's to say I won't have issues with Ubuntu on the same hardware?  Am I right in thinking that way?

I would gladly pay for a Mac Mini from my royalties until paid in full no matter how long it takes.  I know that it doesn't grow much over time but it's all I have to offer.  I know this is long winded, and I apologize for it, but Windows really pushed me to my limits doing what it did and costing me all that work.  I was just about to do a save, too, when it happened.  I'll continue to work with Windows on an "as-needed" basis but, mark my words, as soon as I can get a Mac it's no more Windows for me.  I'm done with Windows.

[Atari 5200 Guy]

See?  THAT is a thing of beauty.  It doesn't try to light up the room, it doesn't try to clean your floors (although it looks like it could).  It's function is to help make your computing needs as easy as possible.  That model is the one I remember Steve Jobs holding at the end of his keynote presentation while I was in college.

[Video 61]

On 12/3/2019 at 12:24 AM, kamakazi20012 said:

I'm sorry guys.  If it sounds like I'm being ungrateful about the things that have been sent for me to use because I'm not.  If all I had to worry about with a computer was a simple memory upgrade, which I know when you upgrade a Mac's RAM it's the happiest computer in the world, then it would bring back the pleasures of using a computer.  Windows lost that a long time ago.  Honestly, I don't think Windows ever had that.  Why do people use the computers they have?  For me it's because I enjoy using them.  If I don't enjoy using them then I simply won't use it.  Windows has reached that point with me.  It's always a struggle, mentally, trying to get Windows to cooperate with even simple tasks.  It's a pain the ass when it does it's blue screen of death while you are working on something important.

That iMac I found shortly after my first wife and I split surprised me.  I spent $30 of my last $40 on me and took a chance on it.  I had to take it to a friend's house whom I worked with at Wal-Mart.  I knew he had a few of them because he used them as work computers as he worked from home, and helped me set it up with a new OS (OS X, just don't remember which OS X), bumped up the RAM, and the thing came to life right before my eyes.  I couldn't believe how simple installing the OS was.  No questions asked.  And the damn thing booted up quick for an old machine.  I was like, "Why can't Windows do such things?"  What surprised me even more was I had a Sony PSP at the time and I needed to charge it so I took advantage and connected it to the iMac I just bought to charge it up.  This old iMac recognized the PSP right away without having to download anything.  While it was charging I was able to browse the PSP's storage to see what all I had on there.  It knew what my PSP was!

I had fun with that little computer thanks to my friend putting some games on it for me to play.  I really liked the Mac suite of, for lack of better wording, office software.  The word processor was awesome and simple to use unlike Microsoft's WordPerfect.  It was a nightmare.  

Like I said before, I can use Windows for things I simply can't do on a Mac.  But I'm to the point I'm done with Windows.  The only thing Microsoft I want to continue to enjoy is XBOX.  That's it.  I'm tired of having to upgrade a machine just to run a piece of software that doesn't work even with upgrades that exceed what the software required.  It's BS, a scam, and I've enough of it.  

Games I play on Windows I can get for a Mac through Steam so I'm not to worried.  Macs are built like a tank.  At least the iMac I owned was and from the keynotes I remember seeing with Steve Jobs showing off the all-aluminum Mac Mini, it looked like it was built like a tank, too.  I just want something that works the second I turn it on, I can do what need to get done, no hassles, no issues, no problems, so I can be more productive.

If you are wondering where all this came from...I was working on something.  Had it half done.  Windows crashed before I could save. I had them open, touching them up as I worked on others, an hour's worth of work.  Gone.  Blue screen of death.  To say it pissed me off would be putting it lightly.  I wanted to destroy every Windows CD I had, wipe out every hard drive I have with Windows on it for use on something different.  I've not once heard of anyone having issues like that on an Apple computer...never.  And from the iPad apps I used before I know that Apple stuff simply works better.  It's tailored for the machines and it works.  I loved the keynotes app I had on my iPad.  It took a LOT of extra work I would have had to do on a Windows machine away.  

I'll admit that today's Apple, since Steve's passing, GOD rest his soul, has been iffy at best.  But when Steve was back at the helm of Apple things were impressive.  I miss seeing his keynote presentations.  "Just One More Thing", and I was on the edge of my seat, as close to the screen as I could get.  Then the Mac Mini appeared and my jaw dropped.  I wanted it.  He didn't have to say any more but he did.  "The affordable entry-level Mac for those that want to make the switch."  And that was it.  I was sold.  I loved what my eyes were seeing.  I never looked at PCs the same again.  Mac was the best money could buy...and I was stuck with POS Windows and the crappy hardware it works with?  Why?  

Yea, with a PC you can add this, pop that in there, double up on the graphics cards (seriously?  who needs that much damn graphics power?), max out all the drive bays with more space than any one will ever need in a lifetime.  What you end up with is a PC that becomes a fire hazard or at least heat your house up pretty good that costs 2 time to 3 times more than the most expensive Mac on the market.  And if you are lucky, it might work half the time if it doesn't shut off from over heating or over loads.  I just want something that works, period, no questions asked, no hassles, no issues, just hit the button to turn it on and do what you need to get done.  If I could I would throw every damn Windows PC I have here in the damn dumpster.  That's where they belong.  I'm done with Windows.  I'll use it only if I absolutely have to.  I'd keep the monitors I have, though, because those work with anything.  I can even use those with an adapter to play HDMI able video game consoles on. 

As for me and Windows...it's time I parted ways with it.  I'm tired of constantly losing hard work because Windows decides it wants to be a d*ck for no reason.  So, nope, I'm done with it.  Here...have a bird of paradise Windows.  If I could use an Atari 8-bit or ST computer to get online and check my emails, visit Atari I/O, and do my YouTube stuff I'd just use those...but I can't.  Ubuntu is a small blessing in disguise but, again, it's on Windows hardware and if I'm having issues with Windows then who's to say I won't have issues with Ubuntu on the same hardware?  Am I right in thinking that way?

I would gladly pay for a Mac Mini from my royalties until paid in full no matter how long it takes.  I know that it doesn't grow much over time but it's all I have to offer.  I know this is long winded, and I apologize for it, but Windows really pushed me to my limits doing what it did and costing me all that work.  I was just about to do a save, too, when it happened.  I'll continue to work with Windows on an "as-needed" basis but, mark my words, as soon as I can get a Mac it's no more Windows for me.  I'm done with Windows.

hi michael,

 

 i know where you are coming from. most people think the peecee is a real computer, it is not. its really nothing more than a calculator, that has been jury rigged to show color, graphics, and sound.

 

 hundreds of billions of dollars has been spent on the machine to get it operating sorta, as good as a 130xe. and its still not as good as a 130xe.

 

 i am checking with my son to see what he has right now.

 

lance

www.atarisales.com

 

[Video 61]

21 hours ago, kamakazi20012 said:

See?  THAT is a thing of beauty.  It doesn't try to light up the room, it doesn't try to clean your floors (although it looks like it could).  It's function is to help make your computing needs as easy as possible.  That model is the one I remember Steve Jobs holding at the end of his keynote presentation while I was in college.

hi michael,

 

 yep, that's the one.

 

lance

www.atarisales.com

[Atari 5200 Guy]

Cool!  I found Emerald Editor for MAC!  AWESOME!  My favorite text editor.  It recognized over 60 different programming languages.  It highlights and colorizes programming keywords.  

Found GIMP, too.  That was easy.  

What else would I need.  Steve?

What I don't want...Boot Camp.  I don't want anything Windows-related at all.  POS PeeCee junk.

Edited December 4, 2019 by kamakazi20012

[Atari 5200 Guy]

With those two alone I should be able to get the job done.   If it keeps crashing then I'll just have to wait or perform a hardware diagnostic some how to see what is at fault.  I'm hoping it's not the SSD drive.  Then again it might be why someone parted with it if it is faulty.  I did do a full CHKDSK run to check for any errors on it before using it and nothing came up bad.  It would be nice if Windows would say, "HEY!  This is giving me problems." and then tell you what/where that problem is.  Nope.  Blue screen with a bunch of numbers and address routines it was trying to perform when it locked up.  ENGLISH is set as my preferred language...not MACHINE language.

I'm not defending Windows or the PC hardware as a whole.  I've been through them enough to know that not all is what it seems.  There are some good, reliable parts in a PC made by 3rd parties like Creative Labs' Sound Blaster sound cards which are hard to come by now.  I never had issues with the Sound Blaster line of sound cards except its driver ate up most of my RAM.  Everything sound related is built into the motherboard now and made by another company that claims "legacy" support.  BS.  ATi and nVidia have both put out impressive graphics cards with really neat capabilities.  But then you run into the issue if the PC it's going in will be powerful enough to even handle it.  And if it does you have to worry about it being obsolete as soon as you start using it because it won't be long before new programs, like games, start requiring more power.  Then what was once top-of-the-line on the PC end becomes useless for anything new on the market.  

From the looks of things, I might not need Windows at all to do work stuff.  It looks like everything I do now on Windows is also on a Mac if it's running OS X.  Man I miss my iPad.  I still have my small iPod Shuffle though.  I'm not parting with that.  I love that thing.  Best $49 I ever spent.  Got the wife one, too.  Her's is pink and mine's the blue one.  Headphones that came with it are not that good, though.  You put a pair of KOSS ear buds with that iPod, though, and it rocks!  Loads of full range sounds with bass, too.  Crystal clear.  I still like my vinyls, though.  Nothing like spinning a good turntable.  But Steve Jobs hit the nail on the head when he said how impressive it was to hold 1,000 songs in the palm of your hand.  I have some of my keyboard work in MP3 format on that thing.  I also have some I made in Garage Band for the iPad.  That was fun.  See...Apple's stuff just works and does what it's suppose to do.   No headaches, no hassles, no issues. 

Apple's stuff is pricey but it's like do you want a Pinto or a Ferrari?  If you want a Pinto you will be putting more money in to it over time.  If you want the Ferrari you will spend a LOT of money up front and very little to none after.  Pinto=Windows.  Ferrari=Mac.  And I'm not a fan of Pintos. 

[Atari 5200 Guy]

Hmm.  Does anyone here know if there are any Atari 7800 emulators available for a Mac?

Found one called A7800.  

Edited December 4, 2019 by kamakazi20012

[Video 61]

On 12/4/2019 at 12:07 AM, kamakazi20012 said:

With those two alone I should be able to get the job done.   If it keeps crashing then I'll just have to wait or perform a hardware diagnostic some how to see what is at fault.  I'm hoping it's not the SSD drive.  Then again it might be why someone parted with it if it is faulty.  I did do a full CHKDSK run to check for any errors on it before using it and nothing came up bad.  It would be nice if Windows would say, "HEY!  This is giving me problems." and then tell you what/where that problem is.  Nope.  Blue screen with a bunch of numbers and address routines it was trying to perform when it locked up.  ENGLISH is set as my preferred language...not MACHINE language.

I'm not defending Windows or the PC hardware as a whole.  I've been through them enough to know that not all is what it seems.  There are some good, reliable parts in a PC made by 3rd parties like Creative Labs' Sound Blaster sound cards which are hard to come by now.  I never had issues with the Sound Blaster line of sound cards except its driver ate up most of my RAM.  Everything sound related is built into the motherboard now and made by another company that claims "legacy" support.  BS.  ATi and nVidia have both put out impressive graphics cards with really neat capabilities.  But then you run into the issue if the PC it's going in will be powerful enough to even handle it.  And if it does you have to worry about it being obsolete as soon as you start using it because it won't be long before new programs, like games, start requiring more power.  Then what was once top-of-the-line on the PC end becomes useless for anything new on the market.  

From the looks of things, I might not need Windows at all to do work stuff.  It looks like everything I do now on Windows is also on a Mac if it's running OS X.  Man I miss my iPad.  I still have my small iPod Shuffle though.  I'm not parting with that.  I love that thing.  Best $49 I ever spent.  Got the wife one, too.  Her's is pink and mine's the blue one.  Headphones that came with it are not that good, though.  You put a pair of KOSS ear buds with that iPod, though, and it rocks!  Loads of full range sounds with bass, too.  Crystal clear.  I still like my vinyls, though.  Nothing like spinning a good turntable.  But Steve Jobs hit the nail on the head when he said how impressive it was to hold 1,000 songs in the palm of your hand.  I have some of my keyboard work in MP3 format on that thing.  I also have some I made in Garage Band for the iPad.  That was fun.  See...Apple's stuff just works and does what it's suppose to do.   No headaches, no hassles, no issues. 

Apple's stuff is pricey but it's like do you want a Pinto or a Ferrari?  If you want a Pinto you will be putting more money in to it over time.  If you want the Ferrari you will spend a LOT of money up front and very little to none after.  Pinto=Windows.  Ferrari=Mac.  And I'm not a fan of Pintos. 

hi michael,

 

 agreed, a better machine for sure. not as good as atari, but just about anything beats a peecee.

 

digital is amazing sometimes.

 

lance

www.atarisales.com

 

[Atari 5200 Guy]

What do you mean not as good as an Atari?  Nothing beats an Atari.  But I would put the Mac Mini on par with Atari before I would any Windows or other PC ever made.  How Windows, or IBM even, ever surpassed the Atari and Commodore computers, or even Apple, is beyond me.  "What can you do with a PC?"  Pfft. Spend your life savings on something that only works when it wants to.  Even with similar parts the Apple Mac is far better than anything made for Windows.  And I know why.  Better quality control.  What gets made as a Windows PC doesn't get monitored for quality as closely as Apple does for its machines.  Apple doesn't put numbers before quality like Dell, HP, and Acer do.  I don't count Gateway or eMachines any more as Acer bought those companies long ago.  Acer crap carried over to those machines.  I never like Gateway anyway and eMachines had too high of a failure rate.  I had one.  Damn optical drive didn't work after a couple of uses.  So...yea...all junk.  

That friend of mine who swore by Apple bought an older iMac laptop (all white in color) and the damn thing worked first thing after all these years.  Nothing wrong with it other than a few scuffs here and there.  But that unmistakable chime Apples make when turned on was almost immediate.  I believe it was a G3 or G4 machine. 

I'm sorry Lance,  I shouldn't be raging here but, dang it man...how am I suppose to do what you guys ask of me if Windows keeps getting in the way?  How can I be productive when Windows keeps acting up where I have to start all over again?  It's maddening and unnecessary stress and headaches I don't need.  Emulators I've tried have all done the same thing in Windows.  Lock up.  One will show the first screen a 7800 game makes when you first put in the cart and turn the machine on...then simply pauses.  No buttons do anything.  The other one ... oh boy ... yea....waste of time.  The ST could use a 7800 emulator LOL.  I don't know why people think Windows machines are the best when their issues are about the same.  Why put yourself through that much trouble just to do the tasks that should be simple to do?  I'm glad that Windows is NOT the only type of PC on the market.  If it was we'd all be screwed.   

[Atari 5200 Guy]

This one is not mine BUT it is the same thing I paid $30 dollars for a while back.  I gave it away when I was living out of my car.  It was getting banged around in the trunk and I didn't want it to get destroyed.  RAM had been maxed out and it could dual boot to OS 9 and OS X.  It could only read CDs but I loved it.  It was simple, easy to use, and just a pure joy to operate and do things on.  The mouse was a bit unusual and took me a while to get the hang of.  To be honest, though, that mouse was the only part I didn't care for.  It just didn't feel right.  I really liked the fact that no screws were keeping it from being taken apart to upgrade or clean...except what was holding the monitor to the shell.  That had screws. Everything else was just slide until it clicked.  Really nice.  It had iTunes I used a LOT.  My pass time then was playing bass along with music I had stored on this machine.  Yea...I miss it.  G3 processor.  Pretty good for what it was.  I still can't believe that even OS 9 was able to see the PSP I connected to it.  Hehe...and I could play DOOM on it!  Hell yea!

[Video 61]

22 hours ago, kamakazi20012 said:

What do you mean not as good as an Atari?  Nothing beats an Atari.  But I would put the Mac Mini on par with Atari before I would any Windows or other PC ever made.  How Windows, or IBM even, ever surpassed the Atari and Commodore computers, or even Apple, is beyond me.  "What can you do with a PC?"  Pfft. Spend your life savings on something that only works when it wants to.  Even with similar parts the Apple Mac is far better than anything made for Windows.  And I know why.  Better quality control.  What gets made as a Windows PC doesn't get monitored for quality as closely as Apple does for its machines.  Apple doesn't put numbers before quality like Dell, HP, and Acer do.  I don't count Gateway or eMachines any more as Acer bought those companies long ago.  Acer crap carried over to those machines.  I never like Gateway anyway and eMachines had too high of a failure rate.  I had one.  Damn optical drive didn't work after a couple of uses.  So...yea...all junk.  

That friend of mine who swore by Apple bought an older iMac laptop (all white in color) and the damn thing worked first thing after all these years.  Nothing wrong with it other than a few scuffs here and there.  But that unmistakable chime Apples make when turned on was almost immediate.  I believe it was a G3 or G4 machine. 

I'm sorry Lance,  I shouldn't be raging here but, dang it man...how am I suppose to do what you guys ask of me if Windows keeps getting in the way?  How can I be productive when Windows keeps acting up where I have to start all over again?  It's maddening and unnecessary stress and headaches I don't need.  Emulators I've tried have all done the same thing in Windows.  Lock up.  One will show the first screen a 7800 game makes when you first put in the cart and turn the machine on...then simply pauses.  No buttons do anything.  The other one ... oh boy ... yea....waste of time.  The ST could use a 7800 emulator LOL.  I don't know why people think Windows machines are the best when their issues are about the same.  Why put yourself through that much trouble just to do the tasks that should be simple to do?  I'm glad that Windows is NOT the only type of PC on the market.  If it was we'd all be screwed.   

hi michael,

 

 when america went the free trade route, it also stopped monopoly power. IBM had more janitors, than apple, atari and commodore had employees. IBM used that massive power to drown out the other three.

 

IBM had more salesmen than apple, atari, commodore had employees. by the time the small three figured out that computers were also going to be business machines, and not just school machines, ibm had the business world locked up.

 the smaller three were still trying to understand that their dos's limited just about everything that needed to be done. again, the menu dos's were awesome and easy to use, but extremely limited, and for no reasons at all.

 

 i knew one of the guys that wrote mydos, i asked him why he made it hard drive compatible, but with the sever limit of only 64 files per directory. that would limit any database to just 64 total files. hardly the stuff for a small business, let alone a big one.  we need thousands of file entries. i have a data base like that written by carey. anyways he could not answer me except he said the small three were just computers for people to tinker around with at home.

 

 this view was from the top to the bottom at all three till jobs figured it out. even atari told me that if i wanted a business machine, go get a peecee, and they had the tt-030 out then. talk about dumb!

 

lance

www.atarisales.com

 

[Video 61]

12 hours ago, kamakazi20012 said:

This one is not mine BUT it is the same thing I paid $30 dollars for a while back.  I gave it away when I was living out of my car.  It was getting banged around in the trunk and I didn't want it to get destroyed.  RAM had been maxed out and it could dual boot to OS 9 and OS X.  It could only read CDs but I loved it.  It was simple, easy to use, and just a pure joy to operate and do things on.  The mouse was a bit unusual and took me a while to get the hang of.  To be honest, though, that mouse was the only part I didn't care for.  It just didn't feel right.  I really liked the fact that no screws were keeping it from being taken apart to upgrade or clean...except what was holding the monitor to the shell.  That had screws. Everything else was just slide until it clicked.  Really nice.  It had iTunes I used a LOT.  My pass time then was playing bass along with music I had stored on this machine.  Yea...I miss it.  G3 processor.  Pretty good for what it was.  I still can't believe that even OS 9 was able to see the PSP I connected to it.  Hehe...and I could play DOOM on it!  Hell yea!

hi michael,

 

 i had one of those, same with both my kids.

 

lance

www.atarisales.com

 

[Atari 5200 Guy]

I remember having to figure things out on the 386 I had.  Running DOS 5.0, later upgraded to DOS 6.22.  I refused to put Windows on that machine simply because even when I had no plans to use Windows it would set aside most of the computer's memory just in case I decided to load it up.  Windows 3.1 would set aside about 1.5 MB of RAM when I only had 2 MB.  Once I figured that out I uninstalled the stupid thing and restored my older versions of AUTOEXEC.BAT and CONFIG.SYS  files.  I also remember some games, even with 4 MB of RAM (system maxed out at 16 MB which was HUGE then), requiring a specific amount of conventional memory.  

Conventional memory, if you don't know, is the first 640k of RAM on a PeeCee.  When you first turned on my 386 you got the VGA card writing, which at the time I had a Trident VGA with 512k of its own memory, top-of-the-line basic VGA for the time.  Required no device drivers which was a blessing.  Then you got the BIOS screen.  I remember it well.  American Megatrends.  The best board I've ever owned.  Anything and everything on that system could be modified right down to the type of processor you put in it.  I eventually swapped out the Intel 386 chip for an AMD chip.  I boosted the computer's speed from 16 MHz with turbo on to 40 MHz with turbo off.  That's one of the reasons why I prefer AMD processors.  They simply work faster.  Anyway...after that DOS loaded up what it needed to function.  CONFIG.SYS set aside buffers and more for basic stuff.  AUTOEXEC.BAT would load up device drivers for any special cards or added accessories installed.  Some were also in CONFIG.SYS depending on what the device was.  With just a mouse driver once everything was loaded up and I got my "C:>" prompt I might have been lucky to have a bit over 500kb free of conventional memory.

When I added a Sound Blaster that conventional memory dropped down to under 500kb.  So I had 140kb of conventional RAM being used.  One game in particular, called Zone 66 from Epic Megagames, was a bitch to get to run.  I don't know how many times I had to constantly remove or change things in both system files to get up to the 550kb of conventional RAM necessary for the game to even load.  It didn't matter how much extended or expanded RAM I had...if my system had less than 550kb of RAM it would not load.  A few other commercial games were just about as difficult to figure out.  I learned real quick how to edit those system files. 

I learned then just how horrible Windows really was.  MS-DOS was not so bad.  I could at least get into the system's functions and do what I needed to do.  Then Windows '95 came along and ruined everything.  Microsoft's move to make Windows more upfront was not exactly a great move.  It has never been stable, always hogged system resources, and took away the functions that could only be done under a DOS prompt.  And then you couldn't play games made for DOS any more because Windows would not give up the necessary resources for the games to work.  I can honestly say I understand what Microsoft was trying to do from the perspective of a non-computer user then.  Windows was trying to make the computer a bit more friendly for those not familiar with a computer at all.  But...they never got it right.  Pretty pictures, shitty reliability.  How Windows ever managed to last as long as it has and why developers continued to support the stupid thing is beyond me.  It was all I knew and could stick with so I had no choice.  Apple computers were simply out of my range.  I did well getting help in obtaining a Windows 95 system when my 386 died for no reason.  

Once I seen the Mac Mini and everything you could do with a Mac I was sold.  The damn thing just works.  And that's more than I could and will ever say about anything Windows related.  And most of Windows' issues is due to the fact it continues to hog everything a computer has installed.  Which I am beginning to think is what is wrong with me using GIMP.  GIMP is probably trying to obtain more memory for me to do what I am doing and Windows isn't allowing it.  Seriously, though, Windows needs to burn in hell.  It's obnoxious, finicky, temper-mental, and anymore is just too unpleasant to try to use.  About the only thing I have been able to do without too much fuss has been to enjoy my Steam games.  But even those require systems designed and built for gaming.  And even the gaming laptop I had would freeze and crash in the middle of a game causing corrupt saved games causing me to have to start all over again and again.  And now it keeps acting up when trying to do two or three sprites in GIMP.  I've tried one at a time and even that is a struggle.  I'm not entirely sure that GIMP is at fault.  Photoshop even has issues with Windows.  Windows is just not developer friendly making it difficult to be productive efficiently.  

[Atari 5200 Guy]

6 hours ago, Video 61 said:

hi michael,

 

 when america went the free trade route, it also stopped monopoly power. IBM had more janitors, than apple, atari and commodore had employees. IBM used that massive power to drown out the other three.

 

IBM had more salesmen than apple, atari, commodore had employees. by the time the small three figured out that computers were also going to be business machines, and not just school machines, ibm had the business world locked up.

 the smaller three were still trying to understand that their dos's limited just about everything that needed to be done. again, the menu dos's were awesome and easy to use, but extremely limited, and for no reasons at all.

 

 i knew one of the guys that wrote mydos, i asked him why he made it hard drive compatible, but with the sever limit of only 64 files per directory. that would limit any database to just 64 total files. hardly the stuff for a small business, let alone a big one.  we need thousands of file entries. i have a data base like that written by carey. anyways he could not answer me except he said the small three were just computers for people to tinker around with at home.

 

 this view was from the top to the bottom at all three till jobs figured it out. even atari told me that if i wanted a business machine, go get a peecee, and they had the tt-030 out then. talk about dumb!

 

lance

www.atarisales.com

 

The small three were just computers for people to tinker around with at home?  What kind of crap is that?  A computer is a computer no matter what breed it is, no matter how small or big it is. 

I remember taking computer programming classes in high school on old EPSON monochrome systems.  We were learning BASIC, which I had learned more at home.  But what we were making were spreadsheet and database programs.  The instructor/teacher kept saying we could do more than 64 files total just like you mentioned.  I thought BS and developed a program that could save to a hard drive up to 512 files.  I broke the barrier and the teacher never figured it out even when looking at my code.  All I did was store every file on the hard drive in a large array.  Each array held records for up to 64 files.  By having 8 arrays I expanded that to 512 files.  It worked but relied on two files.  The first one was a stored array while the second file was the database itself.  When you saved the database entries the program would also save a record of what the array looked like.  When you loaded the program it would look for that array file.  If missing it created a blank one automatically.  Then the program would look for the database file.  If missing it would create that as well.  Each number in the array pointed to a file in the database.  So if you needed a file number 32 in the second array it would fetch the data from the database.  It took a while to develop but the end result was worth it. 

The entire program was about 4k including the two saved files.  I used mine as an example of a movie database.  If a movie title was in the database it only took about 1 second for the program to find and display the movie information. If it wasn't it would ask if you would like to enter the new movie information.  The database stored movie titles, short descriptions, movie genre, rating, running time, and whether the movie was recorded in color or b/w.  If you wanted to you could have the program list every movie the database had, about 12 movie titles per screen.  Once a screen was loaded you could highlight a movie title and press ENTER to get more info or highlight two options at the bottom to advance or go back a screen.    

The one key feature that proved my program was going way beyond the 64 file limitation was a counter when it loaded.  Before turning the program over to user control it would literally count the number of entries in the database.  I purposely put over 200 items in the database just to prove a point.  Limitations are only made to be broken.  I broke it.  I wonder if he ever figured out how I did it.  Then again the guy was cool but had been literally struck in the head like three or four times by lightning checking on his cows during thunderstorms.  I don't know know how many times he told us those stories.  He was one of the best teachers I had, though, but I think I was teaching him more than he was teaching me.  I didn't even need to read the book we were assigned.  It didn't teach me anything new.  Things in it were things Atari and Commodore computers had already done before only much better and more efficient.  Even the Color Computer 3 I had at the time had already did similar things.

[DegasElite]

On 12/2/2019 at 3:55 PM, Video 61 said:

hi steve,

 

 do you ever plan on using the mac mini? i completely understand where michael is coming from.

 

lance

www.atarisales.com

 

First of all, if I do give up the Mac mini to give to Mike, it needs some real upgrading first. It needs at least an Intel Core2Duo CPU and 4GB of RAM to realize its potential. However, you can upgrade the Mac mini I have, with Lance's son's help. It can hook up to a standard television screen using an adapter, which I have for it, using either an RCA video or S-video cable. It really is a pretty cool unit. I would recommend that it gets some upgrading to the RAM and CPU first.

[Video 61]

16 hours ago, kamakazi20012 said:

I remember having to figure things out on the 386 I had.  Running DOS 5.0, later upgraded to DOS 6.22.  I refused to put Windows on that machine simply because even when I had no plans to use Windows it would set aside most of the computer's memory just in case I decided to load it up.  Windows 3.1 would set aside about 1.5 MB of RAM when I only had 2 MB.  Once I figured that out I uninstalled the stupid thing and restored my older versions of AUTOEXEC.BAT and CONFIG.SYS  files.  I also remember some games, even with 4 MB of RAM (system maxed out at 16 MB which was HUGE then), requiring a specific amount of conventional memory.  

Conventional memory, if you don't know, is the first 640k of RAM on a PeeCee.  When you first turned on my 386 you got the VGA card writing, which at the time I had a Trident VGA with 512k of its own memory, top-of-the-line basic VGA for the time.  Required no device drivers which was a blessing.  Then you got the BIOS screen.  I remember it well.  American Megatrends.  The best board I've ever owned.  Anything and everything on that system could be modified right down to the type of processor you put in it.  I eventually swapped out the Intel 386 chip for an AMD chip.  I boosted the computer's speed from 16 MHz with turbo on to 40 MHz with turbo off.  That's one of the reasons why I prefer AMD processors.  They simply work faster.  Anyway...after that DOS loaded up what it needed to function.  CONFIG.SYS set aside buffers and more for basic stuff.  AUTOEXEC.BAT would load up device drivers for any special cards or added accessories installed.  Some were also in CONFIG.SYS depending on what the device was.  With just a mouse driver once everything was loaded up and I got my "C:>" prompt I might have been lucky to have a bit over 500kb free of conventional memory.

When I added a Sound Blaster that conventional memory dropped down to under 500kb.  So I had 140kb of conventional RAM being used.  One game in particular, called Zone 66 from Epic Megagames, was a bitch to get to run.  I don't know how many times I had to constantly remove or change things in both system files to get up to the 550kb of conventional RAM necessary for the game to even load.  It didn't matter how much extended or expanded RAM I had...if my system had less than 550kb of RAM it would not load.  A few other commercial games were just about as difficult to figure out.  I learned real quick how to edit those system files. 

I learned then just how horrible Windows really was.  MS-DOS was not so bad.  I could at least get into the system's functions and do what I needed to do.  Then Windows '95 came along and ruined everything.  Microsoft's move to make Windows more upfront was not exactly a great move.  It has never been stable, always hogged system resources, and took away the functions that could only be done under a DOS prompt.  And then you couldn't play games made for DOS any more because Windows would not give up the necessary resources for the games to work.  I can honestly say I understand what Microsoft was trying to do from the perspective of a non-computer user then.  Windows was trying to make the computer a bit more friendly for those not familiar with a computer at all.  But...they never got it right.  Pretty pictures, shitty reliability.  How Windows ever managed to last as long as it has and why developers continued to support the stupid thing is beyond me.  It was all I knew and could stick with so I had no choice.  Apple computers were simply out of my range.  I did well getting help in obtaining a Windows 95 system when my 386 died for no reason.  

Once I seen the Mac Mini and everything you could do with a Mac I was sold.  The damn thing just works.  And that's more than I could and will ever say about anything Windows related.  And most of Windows' issues is due to the fact it continues to hog everything a computer has installed.  Which I am beginning to think is what is wrong with me using GIMP.  GIMP is probably trying to obtain more memory for me to do what I am doing and Windows isn't allowing it.  Seriously, though, Windows needs to burn in hell.  It's obnoxious, finicky, temper-mental, and anymore is just too unpleasant to try to use.  About the only thing I have been able to do without too much fuss has been to enjoy my Steam games.  But even those require systems designed and built for gaming.  And even the gaming laptop I had would freeze and crash in the middle of a game causing corrupt saved games causing me to have to start all over again and again.  And now it keeps acting up when trying to do two or three sprites in GIMP.  I've tried one at a time and even that is a struggle.  I'm not entirely sure that GIMP is at fault.  Photoshop even has issues with Windows.  Windows is just not developer friendly making it difficult to be productive efficiently.  

hi michael,

 

 even after untold billions, TOS works better, more stable, and can do wonders with 4 megs of ram. apple is better than a peecee, sorta today. but if you could get a  100mghr falcon with 512 megs of ram, you would be in hog heaven.

 

lance

www.atarisales.com